Showing posts with label Apostolic Christianity. Show all posts
Showing posts with label Apostolic Christianity. Show all posts

Lex Anteinternet: Cliffnotes of the Zeitgeist, 64th Edition. Things authentic and important.

Lex Anteinternet: Cliffnotes of the Zeitgeist, 64th Edition. Things ...

Cliffnotes of the Zeitgeist, 64th Edition. Things authentic and important.



Why there?

On Saturday, March 30, Pro Hamas protestors interrupted the Easter Vigil Mass at St. Patrick's Cathedral in New York City.

Why St. Patrick's?

For the same reason, most likely, that LGBTQ+ figures had a protesting funeral there recently. People are drawn to Catholic places, as they're real, and therefore attention is paid to them.

Why her?

Courtney Love, in an interview with Standard, stated; "Taylor is not important. She might be a safe space for girls, and she's probably the Madonna of now, but she's not interesting as an artist."

This followed Billie Eilish criticizing, sort of anonymously, "wasteful artists" who put out multiple vinyl editions, an apparent softball for sustainability.  She later said her comments weren't directed at Swift.

Hmmm. . . 

Why are these chanteuses dissing Taylor?  

I don't really know, but I will note that Love commenting on who is important and interesting in laughable.  Is Love "important" or "interesting"?  If she is, she might be interesting as she's the late wife of the tragic Curt Cobane, whom I don't find to have been particularly important, but certainly tragic.  And for Eilish, she's sort of a teenage train wreck who probably needs to get over her weird diet and flipping between hiding her form and flaunting it.

Taylor is interesting because she's a musical success.  I don't like her music, which I find to be juvenile, but I will note that appearance wise she's a throwback almost to the 1940s, and appears to have gained success while being basically normal in every fashion.  

Culturally, therefore, she might be sort of important in a way.

Love, and Eilish, on the other hand, might be fairly unimportant in every sense.  Musically, right now, it's hard to see what actually is important.  Whoever they are, they aren't in pop music.  

Indeed, much of society seems to be grasping for the authentic and important right now, without much out there in the culture offering it.

Appearances

Back in November, I posted this item:

What the Young Want.* The Visual Testimony of the Trad Girls. The Authenticity Crisis, Part One.

Since that time, this trend locally has noticeably increased.  It's really remarkable.

For whatever reason, I'm a student of people, so I take notice of what they wear.  I'm probably in a minority of sorts that way.  What people wear at Mass is a common topic in Cyber Catholic circles, but the recent turn towards the conservative amongst young, white, female Catholic parishioners is really remarkable.  It's a real rejection of the cultural norm of our era.

Indeed, very recently, even amongst those young women who were part of this group, there's suddenly a change.  One young woman who is routinely at Mass with her family on Sundays, and who typically showed a lot of shoulder (no, there's no problem with that) is now covering up hugely.  Something's changed.  It doesn't, however, carry over to Hispanic or Native American young women, both of whom continue to dress the way they have.  Hispanics have always dressed very conservatively at Mass, but not in a trad fashion. They're keeping on keeping on with that.

News, real news but in a rumor fashion, leaked out recently that the Ukrainian Greek Catholic Byzantine Church is looking at putting in a mission in Casper, which would be a mission of a mission.  I don't know how many Ukrainian Catholics there may be in town, but I'll bet it's a tiny number.  I also bet that the mission church that's thinking of establishing a mission here, which is out of Cody, serves a mostly non-Eastern Rite community.  

Something is going on there too.  At a time at which some in the Latin Rite seem focused on a topic that's frankly jumped the shark, by and large, and which is really a matter of European culture, not biology, the young and rank and file in the pews seem to be moving on.  

Becoming a parody of yourself

One of the risks of taking the long reach for something is that you can end up actually becoming unauthentic in your quest for authenticity.

I'm reminded of Courtney Love again.

On her Wikipedia page, there's a picture of Love wearing a kokoshnik, a stiff hat associated with Russian women.  Russian women don't wear them anymore, and I'm sure they haven't for eons.  She's wearing it with a miniskirt.  It looked absurd, but was probably meant to make a statement.  Or here's another example:

The kind of dumb stuff you say when you actually really care about "your 'basic' fashion sense".

I don't know who Japanese Breakfast is (or for that matter what an actual Japanese breakfast is) but they've showed up on this Twitter headline:

Japanese Breakfast is too busy returning to Coachella and making 'music for bottoms' to care about your 'basic' fashion sense

Oh, bull.  That's the exact thing you say when you've tuned your fashion sense to look like you don't have a fashion sense, so you can appear to stay edgy for Coachella.

M'eh.

Exactly.  

I note this as in the pews are a young couple, they're not married but perhaps engaged, whose family I somewhat know.  From a very conservative background, they're trying to affect the disaffected but conservative look to the max.  Unwashed hair and, for the young man, probably third or fourth hand overcoats from the 1970s with huge hounds tooth pattern. The young woman wears, of course, a chapel veil but also is affecting plain to the maximum extent possible, which is detracting a bit from her appearance.  I do love her very round, plain glasses, however.

Anyhow, when going for something crosses over into sort of a parody, you've gone too far.

Lost

Anyhow, I think this trend has been going on for a while.  It explains the entire Hipster look that's still with us, and was much in force several years ago.

Some days, when I leave the office, there's a young woman coming in.  She's either a Native American or a Hispanic from somewhere south of the border.  She's always dressed very conservatively, with dresses that remind me of what Latin American women traditionally wear.  She always has a big smile when you see and acknowledge her.

She's authentic.

Last prior edition:

Cliffnotes of the Zeitgeist, 63d Edition. Strange Bedfellows.

Lex Anteinternet: The Annual Protestant Meatless Friday Freak Out, Inconveniently Moving Easter for Convenience, and Oliver Cromwell, fun sucker.

Lex Anteinternet: The Annual Protestant Meatless Friday Freak Out, I...:

The Annual Protestant Meatless Friday Freak Out, Inconveniently Moving Easter for Convenience, and Oliver Cromwell, fun sucker.


I started this post right at the start of Lent and then didn't finish it, and was going to trash it, but due to a late Lent event, I'm picking it back up.

The United States and Canada are Protestant nations. They don't really notice it as a rule, and quite a few cultural Protestants like to deny it, but if you are an adherent member of an Apostolic Christian religion, or for that matter probably if you are Jewish or Muslim, you'll definitely notice it.

One of the ways that it oddly comes up is the annual "it doesn't say anywhere in the Bible that you can't eat fish on Fridays" discussion that Protestants in particular, and some very weakly evangelized lapsed Catholics, like to have.  It's ironic as some of the same people will insist that grape juice was served at The Last Supper (nope, definitely wine) or that the Bible says once you accept Jesus into your heart you can go back to sinning (nope, St. Paul in particular warns you can do that and still go to Hell).

Of course, it doesn't say that you must abstain from meat on Fridays.  It's a law of the Church, not biblically imposed. The Bible discusses fasting and gives lots of examples, and it left the office of Bishops to bind and loose.  This is a rule of the Church, which has been bound. 

It only applies to members of individual Churches.  I.e, Catholics are bound, not Lutherans, or members of make it up as you go Christian churches.  Moral laws bind everyone.  Church laws bind the members of the church.

Also, FWIW, fasting and abstention from meat go way back in Church history and used to be much stricter as a practice than it is now.  It's still much stricter in the Eastern churches.  In the East, fasting involves abstention from alcohol, eggs, dairy, fish, meat, and olive oil for the 40 days of Great Lent and Holy Week.  So the Orthodox, for example, are really down to a very bland menu at this point.

That group of people who like to claim that the Latin Rite practice was made up to support the fishing industry are really out to lunch on this one, particularly as the claim is based on a grossly misconstrued concept of what the food economy was like in the ancient world.  If you lived, for example, in a Sardinian fishing town in the Middle Ages, fish is what was for dinner every night.  The fishing industry didn't really need anyone's help to be economically viable.  And at one time the Latin Rite fast more closely resembled the Eastern one.  Claims like that are generally myths of the Reformation, created in jolly old England to justify carrying on with the Reformation when they couldn't come up with any actual good reasons to do so.

For most non-Catholics and non-Orthodox, however, this isn't in the forefront of people's minds.  Restaurants get it, as there are a lot of us, which is why fish based fare shows up this time of year darned near everywhere.  But rank and file Protestants, particularly of the Christmas/Easter variety, really don't ponder this much.  If you live in a state like Wyoming, that's really obvious, as we have very low religious observation here anyhow.  There are a lot of Catholics, but we're a minority.  Protestants who don't go to church often are no doubt the majority, followed by Protestants who go to the new "non-denominational" churches, which is to say the quasi Baptist, churches (there are no "non-denominational" churches).  They can't be expected to know Canon Law.

When you go to a function of any kind during Lent, this becomes pretty obvious.  "Here's your entrĂ©e". . will come the server, serving the beef sandwich between two slabs of beef served with beef fries.

Oh, well.

That you can't suspend this and just go to meatless on Saturday is something people don't grasp.  "You can skip it this time".  No, you can't.  Violation of the rule is a mortal sin.  That seems extreme to non-Catholics, and probably has for a long time, but by the same token we live in an era when a host of other mortal sins, the sexually and marital ones in particular, are ignored by even devout church going Protestants.  If you can convince yourself, getting married for the third or fourth time doesn't mean that you are an adulterer, you can pretty easily convince yourself that eating a hamburger on Fridays in Lent is okay this one time.  Indeed, in some odd ways, the logic isn't that much different.  They both involve appetites and excuses. 

This does make Catholics stick out, and the Orthodox even more, maybe.  In some ways, as the Catholic Church has suspended so many of these rules, the fact that there are some remaining makes Catholics stick out all the more and, in turn, the few remaining rules offend people all the more.  And that is in a way part of the point in the modern world.  It sets us apart, and it should.  Like those who appear with ashes on their forehead on Ash Wednesday, it's going to mark you.

This came to mind as when I got home last night, Long Suffering Spouse announced, "my mother proposed to have Easter Dinner this Friday. . ."

Eh?

Now, by way of an obvious point, we're clearly a "mixed" family.  My side of the family is all Catholic.  LSS's is all non-Catholic.

I don't know where the dinner suggestion stands right now, as LSS isn't saying, which means it must be in the air. She protested this as we have "town jobs" which means that a Friday gathering really isn't a viable option anyhow.  And one of the things about being married to a Catholic means is that the Catholicism will start to be picked up by the non-Catholic party, no matter what.

Beyond that, however, under the current rules for Latin Rite Catholics, (and I'm sure for Eastern Rite Christians as well) on Ash Wednesday and Good Friday, the fasting rules allow Catholics to eat only one full meal and two smaller meals which, combined, would not equal a single normal meal.  We've already seen that the Eastern Rite is fasting by this point every day. Catholics may not eat meat on these two days, or on any Friday during Lent.

Now, I'm over 60 years old, which means the fasting rules no longer apply to me.  As it is, however, that's my normal daily routine anyhow.  I never eat big breakfasts or lunch.  I used to often skip both, but thanks to my thyroid medication, I'm hungrier than I used to be.  Be that as it may, I'm not comfortable with a feast on Good Friday. That's weird, from an Apostolic Christian prospective.  "This is the day our savior was murdered. . . let's just skip ahead to the day he was raised".  

You can't really do that.

Of course, in Cromwellian influenced Protestant America, you probably can.  He wouldn't, as he didn't approve of observing things anyhow, but he so messed stuff up it's never recovered in the English speaking, non-Catholic, world.  Another reason that they've had to hide his head.

Anyhow, I love my in-laws, who are great, but this is pretty much something I'm not going to be able to do.  I can't go to a big Easter dinner on Good Friday and do something like, "wow, that ham looks great. . . I'll just have the mashed potatoes. . . thanks".  The meatless rule still applies to me, and there's probably not going to be a giant cod for an "early" Easter dinner.

That would be weird.

Also weird is that on Good Friday, I have people trying to make appointments.  Most law offices are closed on Good Friday.  But most Americans work as Oliver Cromwell was a theologically deficient fun sucker and our Puritan heritage is ruining everything. Working to the grave is one thing that our Protestant founds in this country really gave to us, and it's one of the things that's really wrong with the culture.  Now, I usually do work, but I've long looked forward to most of the office being out, and only working a partial day.  And it gives me a chance to take Holy Saturday off.

I'm going to have to handle this today.  In prior years I think I would have just said yes, to somebody wanting in, or "the office is closed".  But instead I'm going to just say, the "office is closed for Good Friday".

I'll let the Puritans ponder it.

Lex Anteinternet: Holy Week.

Lex Anteinternet: Holy Week.:  

Holy Week.

 This is Holy Week.  It commenced yesterday with Palm Sunday, which we noted  yesterday:

Palm Sunday

 

Zdzisław Jasiński Palm Sunday 1891.

From City Father:

Palm Sunday

In those countries which were spared the cultural impact of the Reformation, at least directly, at the entire week is one of celebration and observance.  In a lot of those places, people have the whole week off.  Some of Spanish and Central American friends, for example do.

Well, in the English-speaking world we've had to continue to endure the impact of Cromwell and all his fun sucking, so we'll be headed to work instead.

Lex Anteinternet: St. Patrick's Day

Lex Anteinternet: St. Patrick's Day

St. Patrick's Day

A Celtic cross in a local cemetery, marking the grave of a very Irish, and Irish Catholic, figure.

Recently I ran this item: 

Lex Anteinternet: The Obituary: Mira quĂ© bonita era by Julio Romero de Torres, 1895.  Depiction of a wake in Spain. I didn't have him as a teacher in high school, but I...

One of the things this oituary noted was:

"One more St. Patrick’s day craic for you, Dad."

That's nice, but what does that mean?

From Wikipedia:

Craic (/kræk/ KRAK) or crack is a term for news, gossip, fun, entertainment, and enjoyable conversation, particularly prominent in Ireland.It is often used with the definite article – the craic– as in the expression "What's the craic?" (meaning "How are you?" or "What's happening?"). The word has an unusual history; the Scots and English crack was borrowed into Irish as craic in the mid-20th century and the Irish spelling was then reborrowed into English. Under either spelling, the term has attracted popularity and significance in Ireland.

A relative who know the decedent well told me that in later years he really got into "being Irish" and had big St. Patrick's Day parties.

But is that Irish?

Not really.  That's hosting a party.

Granted, it's hosting a party in honor of the Saint, sort of. Or perhaps in honor of Ireland, sort of.  And there's nothing wrong with that whatsoever.  After all, "holidays" comes from "holy days", which were "feasts".   There are, by my recollection, some feast days even during Lent, and for that matter, it's often noted, but somewhat debated, that Sundays during Lent aren't technically part of it (although this post isn't on that topic, perhaps I'll address that elsewhere.

And St. Philip Neri tells us, moreover,  "Cheerfulness strengthens the heart and makes us persevere in a good life; wherefore the servant of God ought always to be in good spirits."

So, no problem, right?

Well, perhaps, as long as we're not missing the point.

The Irish everywhere honor this day, and some of that involves revelry.  Traditionally it was a day that events like Steeple Chases were conducted, sports being closely associated, actually, with religious holidays on the British Isles.  But the day is also often marked by the devout going to Mass, and as the recent Irish election shows, the Irish are more deeply Catholic than some recent pundits might suggest.

Perhaps it might be best, really, to compare the day to the feast of Our Lady of Guadalupe in North America, which is widely observed by devout Catholics, and not only in Mexican American communities.

So, I guess, a purely bacchanalian event, which is so common in the US, doesn't really observe the holiday, but something else, and that risks dishonoring the day itself.  Beyond that, it's interesting how some in North America become particularly "Irish" on this day, when in fact the root of the day, and the person it honors, would import a different type of conduct entirely to some extent, if that was not appreciated.  Indeed, with many, St. Patrick would suggest confession and repentance.

Am I being too crabby?  

Probably, but we strive for authenticity in our lives and desire it.  That's so often at war with our own personal desires which often, quite frankly, aren't authentic.  Things aren't easy.

Lex Anteinternet: Today is St. Dwynwen's Day.

Lex Anteinternet: Today is St. Dwynwen's Day.:

Today is St. Dwynwen's Day.

The ruins of the church built by St. Dwynwen.

She was a Welsh nun of the early Church, having died in about the year 460.

She is the patron saint of lovers, having lived as a hermit on Ynys Llanddwyn off the west coast of Anglesey, where she built a church.  Becoming a hermit was common amongst the extremely devout of the early Church, although it's more common associated with North Africa.  She apparently had been very sought after by a young suitor whom she could not marry, and in her isolation prayed that God look after all true lovers.

Her day is widely celebrated in Wales.

Lex Anteinternet: Really Missing The Point

Lex Anteinternet: Really Missing The Point

Really Missing The Point

Annaba, Algeria, late 19th Century.  Why?  Well, read below.
We must be clear that the modernization of the Church on the great anthropological questions comes through Europe. In the West, there is greater sensitivity towards certain issues such as gender or homosexuality than in Asia or Africa. Although in Europe and the United States the Church is in decline, paradoxically the young Churches that are growing in Asia or Africa are the most conservative. Western societies are moving towards a new idea of mankind, and that game is undoubtedly being played in Europe, which is why there are so many European cardinals in this consistory

Piero Schiavazzi, professor of Vatican Geopolitics at Link University in Rome.

Wow, talk about missing the point.

I don't know why the Pope picks the Cardinals that he does, but if this is the reason, it shows a real misappreciation of the evidence.

The church is on the rise in Asia and Africa, where the parishioners are conservative.

It's in decline in Europe, although that decline tends to be misunderstood and to some degree exaggerated, where contemplating "anthropological questions" is the rage.  It really isn't in decline in the US in the way that's asserted, as overall numbers remain steady, but partially due to immigration.  And not noted by Signore Schiavazzi, conservatism is on the rise in younger American Catholics.

Indeed, also in the West, a recent survey showed that amongst Australian Catholic women, younger women were noticeably more conservative than older ones. 

So appoint European Cardinals who are sensitive to the issues where the Church is failing?

Eh?

The old maxim is that nothing succeeds like success, to which we must presume that nothing fails like failure.

All over the globe, and not just in religion, the older generations that advanced the liberalism of the 70s, 80s, and 90s continue to remain in power in significant ways and don't seem to grasp that the failed legacy of that is not something that younger generations, heavily impacted by it, wish to advance further.

The impact of Cardinal appointments is much like that of Supreme Court Justices.  It's difficult to tell what they'll really do and even more difficult to tell what a Pope will do at first.  But if Signore Schiavazzi is correct, this is a bad sign.  Once again, the Papacy will not make major doctrinal changes, because it cannot, but there have been historic periods of Church failure (some involving laxity) that resulted in large departures from the Church.  History, we're told, doesn't repeat, but it rhymes.  A sort of small Counter Reformation of sorts is going on amongst the young, while at higher levels the necessity for that seems to be not only not appreciated, but perhaps not even grasped.

Also not grasped, seemingly, anywhere in the West is that the colonial era is over.  We apparently have never understood that wind the "winds of change" swept colonial powers out of Africa and Asia, it also swept the cultural balance of the world.

Europe's impact on the world was enormous culturally.  Indeed, it triumphed. But that culture was a Christian one, no matter how poorly grasped that was and no matter how poorly expressed.  Much of what we take for granted, indeed liberalism itself, about "modern culture" is Christian, and pretty much exclusively Christian, in origin.  It's no accident that cultural decay has set in, in the West, as the Christian roots have is culture have been strained by a long competing culture, that of consumerism, of which both advanced consumer society and socialism are expressions.

St. Augustine.  He was a Berber.

But Christianity itself, at least Apostolic Christianity in the form of the Catholic and Orthodox Churches, has never been a European thing.  Indeed, the fundamental event of European culture was the spread of (Apostolic/Catholic) Christianity within it, which forever changed it. But Christianity didn't come out of Europe, and indeed it took the rise of Islam to cause there to be a temporary hiatus in it having a major African expression.  St. Augustine of Hippo was a Berber, not a European, and the Bishop of Hippo Regius, which is modern Annaba, Algeria.

Of course, all of the Apostles were Jews from the Middle East. The first Pope, Peter, was from modern Israel. St. Paul, who dealt with what Signore Schiavazzi calls a "new idea of mankind", as there are no new ideas really, and dismissed the conduct that we now are re contemplating as, well whatever we're re contemplating, was from Tarsus, in what is modern Turkey and which was then part of the Greco Roman world. Pope Victor I, who died in 199, was a Berber. Pope Miltiades was also a North African, as was Pope Gelasius (who was for strict Catholic orthodoxy). Pope Saint Anicetus was a Syrian as was Pope Sisinnius, Pope Constantine, and Pope Gregory III.

What ended the strong influence of North Africa, of course, was the Islamic conquest of the region, although remnant North African Catholic churches held on until the early 1400s.  Even as Christianity has spread around the world, and conquered almost all of non Arab and non Berber Africa, it's been easy to forge that its not a Eurpean religion.

That mistaken impression is about to end, and it can't end soon enough.  Trying to somehow assume that decaying European culture needs to be accommodated, if that's occurring, is a mistake.  It needs to be reformed, and it will be, and a rising Africa and Asia will be part of that.

Lex Anteinternet: The Trads, Rad Trads, and Fellow Travelers.

Lex Anteinternet: The Trads, Rad Trads, and Fellow Travelers.

The Trads, Rad Trads, and Fellow Travelers.

Not Trads. . . or are they?  Or models for trads? Trad fellow travelers?

As our frequent readers (if there are any) know, I'm Catholic.

I'm a very orthodox Catholic as well, but I don't fit into that group of Catholics which Catholic's call "Trads", let alone "Rad Trads".  The "trad" in that moniker stands for "traditionalist" and the "rad", when its applied, stands for "radical".

The photograph above, unfortunately not entirely in focus and in black and white, dates from November 1958.  It depicts St. Anthony's of Padua Church in Casper Wyoming on the occasion of my parents wedding.  the alter rail is clearly visable in this photograph.

Christianity is the largest religion in the world, and the largest Christian religion is Catholicism, which was also the first Christian religion.1  Nonetheless, in the US, which is such a Protestant country that it doesn't realize it's a Protestant country, probably only Catholics know of the existence of Trads and Rad Trads.2 Lots of people are aware that there's a split in the Catholic Church between liberals and conservatives, and that with the aged in control of the upper reaches of the Church right now there's a seeming push towards liberalism, but few outside the Church are aware of Catholic Traditionalist, who are conservative, and then some.

I should note that by using the term "orthodox", I'm in the conservative camp, which is by far the largest part of the loyal Catholic body in the US, and probably globally. Use of the term "orthodox" here is probably confusing to non-Catholics, and even to some Catholics, as it naturally recalls the Orthodox Churches, by which most Americans mean the Eastern Orthodox.  There are also the Oriental Orthodox, being that body of Apostolic Christians who were separated from the rest of the Church and who didn't make it to the later councils.  All three larger bodies, the Catholic, the Eastern Orthodox, and the Oriental Orthodox, are highly similar in most ways but have endured separations due to various reasons.  The schism between Catholics and the Easter Orthodox was the most serious, although but for political reason within Orthodoxy, it'd be over now.  It will end at some point, hopefully soon.

Anyhow, when the schism came about, both Catholics and the Eastern Orthodox referred to themselves as being "orthodox", which for the most part, they actually are.  Orthodox Catholics hold to the magisterium of the Church, and the Eastern Orthodox hold to the tenants of Eastern Orthodoxy, both of which overlap to an enormous degree.  By being "orthodox", members were declaring they did not hold heretical views.  The Church was already known as the Universal Church, and in Latin "universal' is catholic, so when the Eastern Orthodox separated, they had to call themselves something, and they came to be called the Orthodox Church as a symbol that they held orthodox theology, although there was somewhat of a split in views on some things between the East and West.

Anyhow, Catholics who call themselves "orthodox" mean that they hold the full magisterium in their beliefs, and do not agree with innovations that some liberal Catholics would interject.  True orthodox Catholics make absolutely everyone uncomfortable on the religious left and right, and on the political left and right.

And then there's the Trads.

Orthodox beliefs are one thing, but traditionalism is another.  I say that to note it, not to condemn it.

Traditionalist of any kind have a strong attraction to tradition.  I know that's kind of a "d'uh" statement, but it's one we have to start with.   Chesterton, who admired tradition, defined it as follows, with this quote ironically often being used in part to condemn tradition, failing to note the second part about the "arrogant oligarchy":

Tradition means giving votes to the most obscure of all classes, our ancestors. It is the democracy of the dead. Tradition refuses to submit to the small and arrogant oligarchy of those who merely happen to be walking about.

G.K. Chesterton, Orthodoxy.

Chesterton, of course, also gave us Chesterton's Fence, which holds:

Chesterton's Fence:

There exists in such a case a certain institution or law; let us say, for the sake of simplicity, a fence or gate erected across a road. The more modern type of reformer goes gaily up to it and says, “I don’t see the use of this; let us clear it away.” To which the more intelligent type of reformer will do well to answer: “If you don’t see the use of it, I certainly won’t let you clear it away. Go away and think. Then, when you can come back and tell me that you do see the use of it, I may allow you to destroy it."

So who and what are Catholic Traditionalists?

That's a really interesting question.

Wikipedia, which frankly isn't the font of knowledge so commonly believed, defines them as follows:

Traditionalist Catholicism is a movement encompassing members of the Catholic Church and offshoot groups of the Catholic Church, which emphasizes beliefs, practices, customs, traditions, liturgical forms, devotions and presentations of teaching associated with the Church before the Second Vatican Council (1962–1965).Of particular emphasis among Traditionalist Catholics is the Tridentine Mass, a form of the Roman Rite largely replaced in general use by the post-Second Vatican Council Mass of Paul VI.

Wikipedia, footnotes omitted.

I guess that's right, but it's more than that, as I'll eventually get to in this long boring entry.

Born in 1963, like most Catholics alive today, I don't remember the Tridentine Mass.  And I'm a very Western Catholic.  The Ordinary Form of the Mass is the only one I've ever seen in a Latin Rite Church.  I've heard Latin interjected into the Mass, which has become increasingly common in recent years, but I've never heard a Latin Mass.3 Indeed, due to the controversy surrounding the Pope's recent reduction in the allowance of the Extraordinary Form of the Mass, as It's now called, I had to look it up and found that it didn't match at all what my expectations were.  I frankly thought, naively, that for the most part the Latin Mass was the current Ordinary Form, pretty much, in Latin.  No, not at all.

Indeed, the current Ordinary From is not only in the "vernacular", i.e., the language of the culture it is said in, but it reformed the presentation in other very useful and profound ways, greatly expanding liturgical readings in both the Old and New Testaments.4 The improvements were good ones.

This isn't to fault the Tridentine Mass, which was the form of the Mass said between 1570 and 1962.  It's interesting to note, as is so often missed, that the Tridentine Mass was not "the original form of the Mass" but rather one that came in after the Reformation was already underway.  The Tridentine Mass came in with Pope Pius V's bull Quo Primum which made his revised Roman Missal obligatory throughout the Latin Church, except for those places and congregations whose distinct rites could demonstrate an antiquity of two hundred years or more.  Indeed, some of those other Rites still survive, although they are fairly rare.  It should additionally be noted, this didn't impact the Eastern Rite at all.

This made a lot of sense, and it explains a lot about the Latin Rite.  Prior to Quo Primum there were a lot of local forms of the Mass.  This isn't to say that you couldn't go from one place to another and recognize the Mass, but rather that there were a lot of local variations in it. While I don't know it to be the motivator, faced with the Protestant Rebellion, making things more uniform made a lot of sense.

Also making a lot of sense, in an era in which language differences were even more profound than they are today, was having the Latin Rite in Latin.  Latin remained the language of the educated well into the Renaissance, when French began to replace it, but even up into the early 20th Century many very well-educated people learned Latin and some Greek.  To some extent, it's a shame this didn't continue on, and frankly Latin education's decline was a victim of the Church going to the vernacular after 1962.

Anyhow, what made sense in 1570 didn't by 1962, and the Church was now all over the globe and celebrating the Mass in a lot of places that had no cultural or historical connection to Latin at all. Vietnam, for example, which has a notable Catholic population, wouldn't have a group of people who'd have a historical connection with Latin.  That Latin went was not only to be expected, but a good thing.

Latin didn't go because of Vatican II.  Indeed, the Tidentine Mass did not fade because of Vatican II either. The Ordinary Form was brought in by the Pope separately.  That's commonly misunderstood.  But Vatican II brought in a lot of changes, and with the changes Vatican II brought in, came a lot of local changes that were done in it's "spirit".

Alter rails came out, local Priests made all sorts of changes inside churches, and some made some pretty big departures from orthodoxy as things got, frankly a bit out of hand in some places.5 Architecturally, St. Anthony's in Casper Wyoming is a good example of this.  St. Anthony's endured a lot of architectural insult as a result of this era. The marble altar rail came out, heavy brass lanterns disappeared, one of the confessionals was moved for a stand for musicians, and the pews were cocked at an odd angle.  None of them helped the appearance of the church, and since that time additional violence has been done to it for cooling systems and PA systems.  If I were the pastor of the Church, which of course I am not and will never be, I'd reverse them all.

I recall some parishioners expressing discontent about all of this, but then middle-aged Catholics of the 70s and early 80s had grown up in an era in which Priests commanded a lot of respect culturally and by tradition. They might grouse, but just a little, and in muted form.  Younger Catholics of the 60s through the 80s were part of the overall culturally destructive Baby Boom generation, so they couldn't be expected to complain, and probably for that matter a lot of them supported what they were seeing, which fit right in with their Weltanschauung.  They still, in many instances, but not in all, feel that way.  Indeed, some never felt that way.

In our Third Law of History, we observed that "Culture is sticky, but plastic." By this we meant that cultures retain a cultural memory, even if it changes.  It's not always accurate, but the degree to which things are retained, particularly things of value, is often stunning, even if a person didn't always experience it, themselves.

Which takes us to Wounded Knee.

Recently we had an entire series of posts on the 1973 Siege at Wounded Knee.  If you look that up, you'll find that it ostensibly was about discontent over a trial election, but everyone knows it was about a lot more than that, and that it happened at the same general location where the 1891 "final" battle of the Plains Indians Wars, which is to say the final battle of the Indian Wars in general, occured.

Eh? What's this have to do with Catholic Trads?

We'll get to that.

This may simply seem to be a byproduct of the 1960s, by which we mean that decade that really began in the early 60s and ran roughly to 1973, but it isn't, completely.  It is partially.  Beyond that, however, what it reflects is a long smoldering recollection by Native Americans of what was lost. There's a reason that the Native resistors at that event appeared the way they did, with clothing of the American West, a style that had been affected to some degree by Natives in the late 19th Century.  The protest was over their condition, and what they had lost, and a strong indicator that they knew just what that was.

The shock to Native cultures in what would become the United States had begun in 1607 when the first English settlers attempted to establish a colony, and it continued through, well, to this very day.  The Battle of Wounded Knee in 1891 made it plain, however, that their cause was lost with finality.  But their days of true sovereignty and independence were not forgotten. They just smoldered.  The American Indian Movement, Wounded Knee, and the occupation of Alcatraz all occured when whatever was smoldering burst into flame. The fire didn't create what was hoped, but it's never really gone out.

Cultural reactions are often like that.

The flood of change and modernity that came in post Vatican II worked that way as well.

Parishioners, accustomed to acceptance, by and large accepted what occured reactions ranging from joy to mute acceptance to smoldering discontent.  Even from the onset, however, there were some who just wouldn't go along.

By and large, a lot of those people seemed, well, weird.  Observing the 1917 Code of Cannon Law on dress, in the case of women, you could tell who they were, if they were not old, by their retention of the wearing of mantilla's, a sort of lace head covering, by the fact that they would not take communion from an extraordinary minister, and by the fact that they kneeled to receive communion and took it on the tongue6 , all of which were very visible symbols that they weren't going along with changes. The 1917 Code of Canon Law had required head coverings for women, based on the writings of St. Paul on that topic, although it had fallen largely out of use by the mid 70s.  Communion had been on the tongue for an extremely long time, if not originally, and it had been received kneeling, at the now absent alter rail.7 Most Catholics simply adjusted, but they did not.  There were not many of them, however.

In some quarters, resistance went further.  In France, Cardinal Lefebvre formed the Society of Saint Pius X, which rejected the changes wholesale and nearly went into schism, although careful actions by the Papacy prevented that from occurring.  As the SSPX spread, which is not to say that it became large, Traditionalist, or more appropriately Radical Traditionalist, sometimes now had a place to attend Mass that met their outlook.

Catholic (SSPX) Chapel of the Annunciation, Ft. Collins Colorado.


I've passed by this church many times but this was the first time I stopped.  I knew it was a Catholic church of some sort, but I didn't know that it was a Society of St. Pius X Chapel.


The Society of St. Pius X is a controversial Catholic organization that at one time teetered on the brink of being declared irregular.  Under the last three Popes a dedicated effort to keep that from occurring was undertaken and now the SSPX has a somewhat more regular status with the Church but it is still somewhat on the outside, rather than fully on the inside.  When I last checked, which is awhile back, they had been granted the right to perform sacraments, but a person really ought to check if they're a Catholic and planning on going to a SSPX service.


This church isn't really in Ft. Collins (at least not yet), but on a less and less rural road between Ft. Collins and Windsor Colorado.  Technically its a chapel because, I think, canonically the SSPX are outside of the regular diocese for a region and their churches do not, therefore, have full church status in the eyes of the Catholic Church.  Again, I'm not an expert on this by any means.


This chapel appears to be an offshoot of St. Isadore the Farmer church in Denver, and served by it.

Chances are good that the Church would have slowly corrected the bigger abuses that came about after Vatican II without much fanfare or notably controversy but for one thing, the Long Lent of 2002. For Catholics in the United States, and to some degree elsewhere in the Western World, that event fanned the smoldering embers, and they burst into flames.

The Long Lent of 2002 was the year that the homosexual priest abuse scandal broke out.  This was later studied in depth by the Church, resulting in the well known and heavily debated John Jay Report, which concluded among other things that the majority of offenders had been in seminaries in the 40s and 50s, and the acts had peaked in the 60s and 70s.  A lot of things, we'd note, peaked in the 60s and 70s.  While heavily criticized, the Church reacted significantly, with one of hte most notable reactions being a struggle to make sure that seminaries were free of abuse and orthodox.

Indeed, the reaction to the crisis has been much different than often publically portrayed.  While some Catholics of weak faith left the Church, by and large the Church maintained steady numbers throughout the crisis and into the present day.  Departures were offset by entries, as Protestants began to more actively abandon their denominations and enter the Church.  Moreover, as the Internet made resources freely available, young Catholics took advantage of them and self-educated in their faith, turning them towards orthodoxy.  As time went on, the demographic evolution meant that from Generation Jones on down, average Catholics were increasingly more orthodox, and this was true of new Priests as well.  Of course, many rank and file Priest and Parishioners had remained orthodox all along.  Having said that, due to the operation of age, changes came slowly as Priests who had come of age or graduated seminary in the 60s and 70s hung on to the changes that been made in that time period.  This is still the case, with it additionally being the case that older Bishops are often of that era, although some of them are actually conservative firebrands.

That latter fact perhaps demonstrates that once things caught on fire, they really started burning.  Catholics who had more or less put up with things being dissatisfactory to them, suddenly quite begin that way, all the way from issues large to small.  Topics ranged from getting rid of the guitar mass (thankfully) to bringing back the Latin Mass.  Indeed, the Extraordinary Form of the Mass came back, due to Papal authorization, and spread fairly significantly.

As this occured, the ranks of the Trads increased, jointed by near Trads. Rad Trads increases as well.  All of these groups were heavily represented by those in Gen X through Gen Z.  Where available, Trad gravitated towards the Latin Mass, and Rad Trads certainly did.  That leads to observations such as this:

Jeremy Wayne Tate
@JeremyTate41
I do not typically attend the Traditional Latin Mass (I can hardly get the eight of us to the local parish five minutes away on time). But this is where you will find young Catholic families. The younger generation is rebelling against modernity.

There's a lot to be said by that observation.

I myself made a Mass attendance change recently, which is what brings this up, sort of.

I was baptized at the downtown parish and basically grew up attending it, although my parents would occasionally go to the nearby, smaller neighborhood parish.  It's closer, but not much, so we were equidistant, basically, to downtown.  When my son was first born, we went there, but we soon switched to the large across town parish, which had a better cry room.  When the kids were older, we started going downtown again.  I became really comfortable with that parish, and served as a lector and in other ways.  All in all, over about a 20-year span, it really became my home parish.

After our most recent Bishop came in, it became clear that a determination had been made to make that the Hispanic Parish.  That's fine, and that evolution has happened all over, but it also meant that there was really no place left for a guy like me.  This was particularly so as I always attend early morning Mass.  So I went to the big across town parish. 

The priest there was an excellent one, whom I first encountered when I lived in Laramie.  He as the priest at the Newman Center, and was one of the priests that baptized our children across town (they were both baptized at that parish).  My wife, who is not Catholic, really likes him, although she's not a frequent Mass goer.  When Masses resumed post COVID, the early morning Mass there was at 7:30 a.m., in order to allow time to clean the Church between Masses.  I really liked that.

That Priest has now retired.  Indeed, the Priest who was longest at the downtown parish while I was there is soon to retire.  The priest who was a the neighborhood church went back to his native India, all in short order.

The new priest downtown is an excellent Wyoming homegrown priest who was born in Puerto Rico, probably prefect for his assignment.  At the big across town parish, a solid priest who had the oddity of being in one town for most of his priesthood has come in.  He's a good confessor, but not a great homilist by any measure. At the neighborhood church, however, a new, quite young, and highly orthodox Priest, is now there.  I've started going there.

That he's quite young is interesting in and of itself. Extremely articulate and with acute observations, I've never encountered a homilist quite like him.  Others must have thought the same as, on Sunday mornings, the early morning Mass, I'm seeing a lot of the old orthodox Catholics that I knew from downtown, whom I'd note are not Trads.  I'm also seeing, however, a fair number of Trads.

Indeed, I've never encountered so many Trads routinely at Mass before, mostly identifiable, I should note, due to the appearance of the women. They are very conservatively dressed, but not necessarily "plain" dressed, particularly for younger women.  They wear the mantilla. At least one of the young women who affects this appearance is with an older couple (not as old as me) who must be her parents, but who are not dressed in that fashion, which raises another point. They may not be Trads, but they're likely conservative orthodox or perhaps near Trads. That would likely describe the young couple who sat in front of me last Sunday, who were dressed in contemporary fashion, but with very nice clothing.  The young man was wearing dress slacks, shirt and tie, something that is unusual for young men in this region to wear anywhere. When going to Communion, they crossed lines so that they'd receive from the Priest and not the Deacon, a very Trad thing to do, but they didn't drop to their knees when receiving (and in fairness, the young woman was holding a baby and could hardly do that).

One family of Trads that goes to that Mass I know, and like me, the family has migrated from the downtown Parish, to the across town one, to here.  Clearly the conservative and orthodox of all stripes are coming here, packing at least two of the Masses, to hear from the orthodox young Priest.

And his homilies aren't necessarily of the type that would make a person feel all warm and fuzzy. One of the first ones I heard, or perhaps the very first one I heard, was one I've written about earlier, that being the "Uncomfortable Homily":

The Uncomfortable Homily.

The young pastor of one of the church's of the triparish gives homilies that are really hard to ignore.  Impossible, in fact.  They're very orthodox, but also almost guaranteed, quite frequently, to make every one in the parish squirm.  Indeed, so much so that I had decided not to post this at all, and then I started watching legislators who would raise a Christian flag make some, well morally debatable decisions, so I decided to revive it.

The four sins were:

1. Murder.

2. Failing to pay the servant his just wage.

3.  Sodomy 

4. Abusing immigrants.

He had these as the four sins "that really tick God off".

Probably the only one of these that doesn't make somebody upset is the first one.   It's pretty obvious that you shouldn't kill other people.

I'm going to dive into these a bit, save for murder, which probably causes people who stop in here to wonder, "when is he every going to get back to the point of this blog?";

That's not something that fits into the Protestant Health and Wealth Gospel at all.  It's also not one that fits very well into the world outlook of my Republican Catholic friends either, who would no doubt agree with topics 1 and 3, but who might squirm at 2 and 4.  For that matter, Catholic liberals might rejoice at 2 and 4, but balk in a major way at 3.

A homily that makes everyone uncomfortable is probably what everyone needs to hear.

The Trads might need to hear it less than the others, however.  They're not killing anyone, most of them probably not only are paying their servants their just wages, they likely don't have any, they're not practicing homosexuality, and they likely aren't abusing immigrants.

Pope Francis seems to think that some of them were acting without due respect for his office, and that is a danger of setting yourself apart.  You can get arrogant.  That provided his stated basis for clamping down on the Extraordinary Form of the Mass.  When the Pope greatly restricted the celebration of the Extraordinary Form in 2021, I thought the controversy it caused would rapidly fade, but it hasn't.

That's in part because Traditionalist have kept it alive, but the Pope, while certainly not intending to, helped keep it alive by convening the Synod on Synodality, which hasn't yet taken place, but which will this Fall.  The process of convening and gathering the Synod has made a lot of Western orthodox Catholics uncomfortable, and it certainly has the Trads.  While Pope Francis' style may very well contain an element of gathering opposition to things in order to expose it to light, and thereby bring an end to it, the inclusion of people like Fr. James Martin, S.J. can't help but make the orthodox, conservative, and the traditionalist suspicious.  The entire process has pushed people who already were opposed to the Pope further in that direction, and made cautious orthodox, such as myself, come over to the "not keen on Pope Francis" camp.  So, perhaps not too surprisingly, where the Trads have a Tridentine Mass available, they'll travel some distance to go it. Where they don't, as here, they're gathering where the Priest is clearly orthodox.

But they aren't the only ones.

I see the Mass packed with people that I know went to another Parish.  Some went downtown and now feel homeless, something I warned might happen as the focus of that Church was directed towards a specific group. Attendees at the across town Parish who went there, as I did, probably grew weary of the non-challenging homilies that didn't really focus on the crisis of daily living.

And it is a crisis.

That is, living in our times is a crisis.  Or our times are in crisis.  It's pretty clear.

And modernity brought that crisis about.

The post World War Two evolution of Americans from human beings into "consumers", and the surrendering of economic life of all types to capitalism brought it about.  Nothing matters other than corporate profits.  Even biology is now bought and sold to serve the corporate masters.  The fences were taken down, and the metaphorical bulldozers came in.

Millions are sick of it, but millions don't know where to go.  Quite a few have gone into drugs and alcohol, which the corporate masters are only too happy to provide.

Which brings us to this.

Can authentic religious traditionalism truly make it in a non-traditional world?  Indeed, can traditionalism at all, in any authentic sense, make it in a non-traditional world which, by its very nature, is set against tradition.

We have to be careful here, of course.  Critics would note that the world never really stops moving, and therefore all traditions are subject to change, but that's simply incorrect.  Indeed, the very long retention of some traditions in many cultures proves the opposite of that, and the preservation of the existential certainly does.  Indeed, Catholicism shows the long retention of things in and of itself, although this falls outside the category of tradition, as writings on the early Mass show it to be, well, the Mass, as Protestants are often shocked to learn. I.e., Christians were celebrating on Sundays a gathering recognizable as the Christian Mass.

But is this true, overall:

The younger generation is rebelling against modernity.

Clearly not all of them all.  A trip anywhere there are people of thirty, not traditionally regarded as young" and younger will reveal plenty of heavily tattooed, pink hair, sporting people, gender bending, and any number of things which can not be regarded as traditional.  Oddly enough, however, they're lashing out against the real world of modernity as well.  But what is deeply authentic traditionalism in this context?

Clearly, some of the Trads have applied it in their family lives.  But to really be traditional overall, it'd have to go some distance beyond that, it seems to me.  One young woman I was somewhat familiar with, for example, was clearly a Trad from a Trad family, but it was also one in which policing was an occupation. All the children became very Trad, one I somewhat knew being in the seminary briefly, and one that I didn't entered an Eastern Rite seminary.  One seems to have entered agriculture, a very traditional occupation, but the young woman entered the Sherriff's Office, not a traditional occupation for a woman at all, although certainly one that women do today.

That's just an illustration, of course, but the larger argument would be here that traditionalism more or less has to be agrarianism to really buck full societal traditionalism in this day and age.

Or so it seems to me.

Footnotes.

1. I know some American Protestants will dispute that, but it's completely counterfactual to maintain otherwise.

2. Indeed, the US is such an English Reformation contrary that to be a knowledgeable Catholic is to constantly be presented with the myths of the English Reformation by people who have only those myths to go by, even if they're non-religious. Even some Catholics believe these myths, in no small part because existing in a sea of Protestantism means that quite a few Catholics are heavily Protestantized.

3.  When I was a kid, probably in grade school I remember being at a Mass at Our Lady of Fatima in Casper when I turned around at the Sign of Peace and a friend of my father's, sitting behind me, greeted me with Pax vorbiscum, Latin for "Peace be with you".  I had to ask my father

4.  Protestants who aren't familiar with the Catholic Church are often shocked to learn that the Church includes a lot of the Old Testament into its liturgy.

5.  There are no surviving altar rails that I've seen in Wyoming.  Indeed, I can't immediately recall having been in a Catholic Church that had an altar rail in recent years, although I well remember the one that was in St. Anthony's in Casper.

6.  Extraordinary minsters are those Catholics appointed within their parish to administer communion.  They do not conscecrate the hosts, but merely administer communion.

The practice is really supposed to be limited to situations in which the number of people strain the ability of the Priests and a Deacons to administer communion, but it's unfortunately become routine for Mass and those so appointed will actually step up and volunteer if there do not appear to be any at the Mass.  Only very recently have I seen a Priest actually raise a hand to turn one back when not needed, and frankly, they're very rarely ever needed.

Rad Trads, and a lot of Trads, will not receive from an Extraordinary Minister for some reason, perhaps they feel the practice is abused. Some will not receive from a Deacon, and I suspect that some object as many Extraordinary Ministers are women.

7.  Unfortunately, people don't accurately remember that people filed up to the altar rail, kneeled, and the Priest went down the rail to the waiting parishoners.

Now, a lot of Trads and Rad Trads drop to kneel in front of the Priest which, as we know file in lines up to the Priests, is a surprise if you are not ready for it.  Generally, I've grown used to it so I expect it, but this was not always so, and given the nature of line psychology, I'm amazed that I haven't seen somebody trip over a suddenly kneeling person.

FWIW, Communion was originally in the hand, but many people regard the on the tongue administration of Communion, which was long common in the Latin Rite, to be more reverant.  Communion is administered differently in the Eastern Rite.  It is on the tongue, but with a host that has been dipped in the Precious Blood.




Lex Anteinternet: A conversation with an old friend. The Good Death, and the Good Life and Existential Occupations.

Lex Anteinternet: A conversation with an old friend. The Good Death... :  A conversation with an old friend. The Good Death, and the Good L...